Hello all, I found a post on a Facebook Group page called Part 15 AM and FM Radio
a poster brought up a radio station operating on 87.9 MHz and a news article related to it on a publication web site, could be a local news paper.
The station of 101thepoint operator has a Facebook page and a web site which are www.101thepoint.com and www.facebook.com/101thepoint
Conversations regarding this station are not positive and in fact, are going to put this guy in the FCC spotlight real quick, specially since licensed broadcasters are now aware of this station and would most likely contact the nearest field office and report it.
On the article page I have posted my concerns regarding part 15 FM broadcast devices not being useable because we have no choice but to compete with full powered stations on the 88.1 to 107.9 MHz spectrum. Where we have to accept interference but can't create it against a licensed station.
I have simply asked for ONE channel be awarded to part 15 devices where no licensed part 73 stations can operate and people think I am asking for the world here.
I DO NOT condone PIRATE radio activity as an answer to wanting a rule change for the right to use a part 15 device on the FM radio spectrum, on the frequencies of 87.9 MHz or 87.7 MHz, to which comments have been made that ANY long term broadcasting in the spectrum below 88.1 MHz is illegal, with the exception of licensed television stations on channels 2 through 6.
In fact one comment was made by REC owner Michelle Bradley which is:
Anything on 87.9 is illegal under 15.209:
** Except as provided in paragraph (g), fundamental emissions from intentional radiators operating under this section shall not be located in the frequency bands 54-72 MHz, 76-88 MHz, 174-216 MHz or 470-806 MHz. However, operation within these frequency bands is permItted under other sections of this part, e.g., §§ 15.231 and 15.241.
(g) Perimeter protection systems may operate in the 54-72 MHz and 76-88 MHz bands under the provisions of this section. The use of such perimeter protection systems is limited to industrial, business and commercial applications.
15.231 - deals with transmitters for periodic transmission (no more than 5 seconds at a time)
15.241 - addresses 174-216 MHz
And she also said:
Unlike 87.9, fundamental emission is permitted on 1710 kHz but not under the Part 15 AM rules. Instead, 15.209(a) permits a limit of 30 mV/m at 30 meters (not much).. You may be able to go to 100 mV/m at 30 meters under 15.223
******************END OF QUOTES***********************
Under the current rules, using part 15 on those frequencies is illegal and falls under the PIRATE radio syndrome.
I truely think those who choose to use Part 15 devices in the FM spectrum, whether it be to broadcast or simply use as an in home intercom system for music or general in home audio distrubution system, should have the legal right to use such systems without interference from corporate big dollars such as licensed broadcast station owners.
The problem in this country, is money buys you everything, including frequency spectrum and leaves the less endowed with no rights at all.
Asking for one channel out of 200 channels is seen as asking for too much, because it curtails to someone who does not have corporate finances asking for 100 Hz of frequency spectrum.
Please read the article here and you will see my comments on that page at the bottom in the comments area.
As for the Facebook page comments, you'll have to be a member of the Part 15 AM and FM Radio facebook group to see those. The intitial post in that group was made by Adam Ebel.
Bruce.
Licensed broadcasters typically try to avoid the FCC as much as possibl. More likely they would have their engineer or engineering firm check it out if the station became a problem.
As far as a dedicated frequency for part 15, I can see both sides of the argument.
FWIW, the station on 87.9 they are discussing wouldn't even be legal on 88.1 or other authorized frequency. The thing is clearly overpowered.
Listen, I know lack of education is no excuse here.
But you can not expect everyone to know right away at birth, what is and isn't legal with Part 15.
We all have to learn some how, one way or another, but until that full knowledge is gained, there are those who don't mean to break a law, but do so unintentionally, after all unlike drivers licenses, which 99% of the US population has, broadcasting is an entriely different right, to which knowledge is gained through other channels. So we can't compare speed limits of roads to broadcast transmitter power output levels.
We also have to acknowledge that there are two avenues to which any interested party can follow. The right ones and the wrong ones. We have no control over the wrong avenues, but we do try to express there is a difference between the two and point to the correct avenue.
We all know human beings have some form of curiosity in the DJ or broadcasting industry, whether it be a DJ or a news commentator on television, it begins with very little behind the scenes knowledge of what it all actually curtails and that laws have to be followed when any type of broadcasting is invloved.
Yes, transmitters are readily available to anyone, including FM transmitters that emit a lot of RF energy up to 1000 watts. Even if you close down the Chinese transmitter import market, those who really want to run a high powered radio station, can build a transmitter and add an RF linear amplifier to the antenna line and defeat the import ban.
I peronally believe, the person involved, who simply wants to provide a service to his community, has taken the wrong avenue and needs guidence from the right people. This same person, has expressed interest in a LPFM.
Let's just say, on the record, I have had personal contact with the station owner, because, I TRUELY DO NOT WANT THIS PERSON TO GO THROUGH WHAT I DID with WXTZ 87.9 Norwich!!
Whether it was seen that I was a pirate for operating on 87.9 FM or simply because I was competing with commercial licensed stations in my area, or one my station's transmitters were putting out excessive RF enery, I can not be sure, but I can not stand by and see someone else go through the BS like I did for what ever reasons it was all about!
Naturally, I shut my operation down, rather than fight with idiots, because, my operation did not just invlove me, it invloved 8 transmitter owners who were simply the harbourers of the transmitters. Their personal concerns were foremost my concern.
If this person joins this board, I hope we can help them and educate them with the right avenues to follow to avoid an FCC visit.
Bruce.
I could understand if this guy was just doing Part 15 broadcasting as a hobby.
But he's building a business. And he's marketing that business through newspaper interviews (and probably other avenues).
So he's either committed a huge gaffe by not doing his due diligence on what is legal, or he knows full well what he's doing and is hoping to get away with it.
If it's the former (and I hope that's the case), then he's dropped that business into a huge hole before it's even started. He's going to look pretty bad when he's shut down by the FCC. Part 15 AM is the only way to go if he wants to have the range he's getting now, and the sooner he realizes that, the more likely that his business has a chance of surviving.
I'm listening to the stream of this guy's station. Pirate or not, its nothing more than another mechanized, automated, heartless, vanity jukebox with a couple of meh imaging liners. I lost interest after four songs.
If you're going to do local radio, DO LOCAL RADIO. Give something unique to your community. Don't clog the band with yet another useless signal that you can find all over the FM dial, all over the streaming music services, and on your own MP3 player.
Bruce, Im not on Facebook so I can't post my comment to the Martinsville Bulletin article link. Please feel free to adopt anything I've said here and post it there if you are so inclined.
he has caught the attention of local engineers and broadcasters and is being discussed on one of my engineering email lists now by them.
What gives he's just another top 40 station. why is he saying 101 the point when he's broadcasting on 87.9? He should have said 87.9 the point.
look I'm all for 87.9 Mhz for hobby broadcasting but I don't think another business radio stations should be there. But at the same time I wouldn't be the one that would play narc on him. Unless he's broadcasting interference. Collinsville is about 4 hours from me I looked it up because I was going to try to pick him up on the radio but that's much too far.
has deleted the entire topic and all the comments. it appears to be gone.
I contacted The Point through their web page, and indicated to them that 1) not only are they not broadcasting on a legal frequency but 2) their signal strength appears to be well over legal limits, based on the range that was reported. I suggested that they join the ALPB and conduct some due diligence into what exactly was legal, recommending that they look at Part 15 AM if they want to legally achieve similar range to what they're getting now on FM.
I warned them that their newspaper article, as well as subsequent discussions on Facebook, have put the spotlight on their activities, and not in a positive way.
We'll see how they respond, or if they respond at all. As Bruce indicated, perhaps they just didn't know what they were doing, and the situation can be saved.
Pat 15 Engineer, you're right. Sometimes posts drop down and are hard to find, but that one has definitely disappeared. I wonder what the rationale for that decision was, as talk and even admissions of blatant pirate activity are rampant in that group. The only reason I participate is to attempt to provide some sort of counterpoint to those kinds of discussions.
... The only reason I participate is to attempt to provide some sort of counterpoint to those kinds of discussions.
__________
Kindly note that in my experience such counterpoint is not always, or even usually accepted by the moderator(s) of websites relating to the operation of unlicensed AM/FM systems subject to FCC Part 15 -- even when such counterpoint is true.
I'm sure it will be business as usual as long as they are not interfering with anybody. I didn't get to see what type of range they were reporting though.
That was one of the reasons we try the initiative movement. It was to try and make 87.1 through 87.9 legal. Yet nobody wanted to participate. I think I'll contact these guys and have them join up with us.
Rich said "Kindly note that in my experience such counterpoint is not always, or even usually accepted by the moderator(s) of websites..."
How you say it is the key, Rich.
Thelegacy said "I'm sure it will be business as usual as long as they are not interfering with anybody..."
I doubt that very much, particularly since the station is advertising and making itself known.
And I'm sure that everyone who participates here (and on other Forums) would welcome the expansion of the FM band, including use by Part 15 broadcasters. But there's a difference between wanting it, and actually thinking that it has a chance to happen.
I'm still waiting to hear if anything has been received back from the FCC about the use of Part 15 transmitters in the whitespace frequencies. I know that Industry Canada specifically has allocated those frequencies (at least for now) to non-broadcasting applications.